Form 8915F

[cruiser626]

I am having trouble with the form 8915F and was wondering if anyone else knows what to do.  It will not

let me put any numbers in and if I override then I can not efile.

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

Use the 8915E worksheet, that will transfer the figures over to the 8915F.

[cruiser626]

I did fill in the 8915E and the amounts do not transfer onto the 8915F.  I called intuit for a solution and

they have not solved the problem

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

Im guessing you didnt fill out the 8915E correctly....

You check the box B at the top that its a 2020 corona virus distribution, then your dollar amount (the 1/3 amount thats taxable in 2022) gets entered below on Line 2 and 5 and that should automatically fill in Line 9 which then transfers over to the 8915F on Lines 12, 13 and 15.

[PATAX]

@rcooley25 is the expert on this matter. If he can't help you no one can.😉

[cruiser626]

I did what you suggested and it added to the pension instead of reducing the amount.  I was on the phone with Intuit for 2 hrs and they could not find a solution.  Any other help would be appreciated.

[sjrcpa]

What do you expect to get reduced?

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

reducing what?    you should have additional income with the 8915F.

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

Oh wait, maybe I misunderstood...is this a new 2022 casualty loss of some kind?   

I was expecting it to be for the Coronavirus 2020 distributions.

[rcooley25]

Thanks for the compliment.

[cruiser626]

It supposed to reduce the income because we are spreading the income over 3 years.  It will not transfer the figures onto the 8915F

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

Is this a 2022 distribution for a disaster area? 

Scroll down the 1099R worksheet, you should find the place to tell the program that the distribution is a 2022 disaster distribution.

[cruiser626]

The problem is when I do the 8915E as you told me what it does is add the amount of repayment to the already taxed on the 1099R.  Last year it took the whole amount and taxed 1/3 of the total.  Now it is taking the whole amount and adding the extra onto the 1040 page one.

[cruiser626]

Where on the 199R worksheet should I fill out?

[cruiser626]

No this all started in 2020.  I did the 2021 and everything came out right.  What is the difference between 2020 and 2022?  When I scroll down the 1099R it tells me that I have an error.  

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

Ohhhh, you have a repayment of some of that 2020 distribution?

[cruiser626]

I had no idea that part of the distribution had to be payed back.  I looked at the IRS website and it said nothing about payback.  I really appreciate all the time you put into this for me.  I have also been doing taxes for 40 years and have never had this happen to me.  I try to keep up with all the changes but this was totally out of my comprehension.  Again thank you for your knowledge and time.  

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

I havent had a repayment either...let me dig around a bit.

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

OK, I see the repayment line on the 8915E wrksht, and that carries the amount over to the 8915F as a repayment on Line 17, but I dont see the current years taxable distribution being reduced anywhere, the full amount still appears on the front of the 1040.

Maybe we have to amend for these repayments?  That doesnt right though.

   @TaxGuyBill you had any repayments of the coronavirus distributions?

[dkh]

I had client repay the full amount in 2021.  It required the 2020 return to be amended.  

If it was repaid in 2022 then 2020 and 2021 will need to be amended.

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

Wow, well that makes sense why it doesn't work properly on the form, but that's a PITA.

So what if you didnt pay back the full amount, what if you only paid back 50% of it?  

Say I got a 30,000 dist in 2020

in 2022 I pay back 15,000. 

Does the 2020 get amended to remove the whole 10k,

then 2021 amended to remove 5k,

then you pay the tax on the 10k in 2022?

[dkh]

@cruiser626   I found this article very helpful when I was trying to figure out how to handle a payback of the Covid distribution.   I was lucky my client paidback the entire amount.

 https://www.asppa.org/news/coronavirus-related-distributions-repayments-and-reporting

[cruiser626]

It is not fully taxing the entire amount of distribution.  Only a part of it.  It is increasing her total distribution by $6536.00.  I do not understand why she has to repay the amount.  The IRS said that the distribution could be taxes every year for 3 yrs. by 1/3 percent of her total distribution or death benefit and I cannot get the form to do anything right.  The 1099R is for $61,260.00 for 2020 it was taxed at $20,420.00 and the same amount in 2021.  So I do not understand how if she has to pay back why it is adding the $6536 instead of the $20,420.00 and this is the 3rd year why is it not letting her get her third year?

[TaxGuyBill]

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@cruiser626 wrote:

No this all started in 2020.  I did the 2021 and everything came out right.  What is the difference between 2020 and 2022?  When I scroll down the 1099R it tells me that I have an error.  

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I still don't quite understand the situation, so maybe you can clarify:

1. Is this ONLY for a 2020 distribution that was spread out over 3 years, and you are preparing the 2022 tax return?
2. If so, why are you entering a 1099-R?  There shouldn't be a 1099-R for that.
3. Did the taxpayer make a "recontribution" in 2022, which basically means they rolled-over/ paid-back part or all of the 2020 distribution?

[dkh]

Taxpayer did not HAVE to pay it back but can choose to pay it back to save the taxes paid on the distribution.

[TaxGuyBill]

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@Just-Lisa-Now- wrote:

So what if you didnt pay back the full amount, what if you only paid back 50% of it?  

Say I got a 30,000 dist in 2020

in 2022 I pay back 15,000. 

Does the 2020 get amended to remove the whole 10k,

then 2021 amended to remove 5k,

then you pay the tax on the 10k in 2022?

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The recontribution first affects the current year.  So 2022 would have $0.  The other $5000, you can choose which year to amend to take off that $5000.

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

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The recontribution first affects the current year.  So 2022 would have $0.  The other $5000, you can choose which year to amend to take off that $5000.

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Well thats where the problem lies, the repayment in 2022, doesnt seem to flow to the 2022 8915F and reduce the 2022 distribution.

[dkh]

@Just-Lisa-Now-   more or less yes   Depending on when it was repaid.   If that $15000 was repaid in 2021  2020 gets amended and 2021 reports less taxable.   If repaid in 2022 - nothing taxable in 2022 then would amend 2020 and 2021 

Not sure how IRS tracks all of this when partial payments are allowed for up to 3 years.

[cruiser626]

Well she did get a 1099R for the total distribution and no she has not paid anything back and what does it mean that she doesn't need to pay it back. This is getting very confusing.  I cannot see the anyone in the IRS that can keep track of any of this. Well unfortunately I have to do something real quick the final day is coming upon us.

[TaxGuyBill]

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@cruiser626 wrote:

Well she did get a 1099R for the total distribution and no she has not paid anything back and what does it mean that she doesn't need to pay it back.

---

She received a 1099-R  in 2020, right?

She did NOT receive a 1099-R in 2022, right?  Or did she for some reason receive one in 2022?

Did you have this client last year, and rolled over the file to 2022?  Or is this a new client, and you are entering things for the first time, and trying to get the software to do it correctly?

It was an option for taxpayers to 'pay back' the distribution within 3 years to remove the tax.  But if your client did not do that, don't worry about that.  That is perfectly fine and makes figuring out your problem easier.

[qbteachmt]

"The recontribution first affects the current year."

If you want to keep a reference, you'll need the full gamut. It matters if they opted to include it all in the first year (would need to amend) or took the spread. And don't forget: the repayment window is three years from the date of the distribution (not three tax years) beginning on the day following the date they received the distribution, so anything taken in first quarter 2020 no longer qualifies for repayment as of today, April 2023; and, the original return(s) must have been timely filed including extensions.

The IRS refers you to this guidance (from Katrina):

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/n-05-92.pdf

[cruiser626]

Yes, she received a 1099R for every year.  This year included.  I did her taxes in 2021 but not in 2020.Nothing that I do seems to work.  She knows that she owes a lot of money.I just hope that she is not paying IRS more money than is necessary. I know that she did not repay anything in 2020 or 2021.

[TaxGuyBill]

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@cruiser626 wrote:

Yes, she received a 1099R for every year.  This year included. 

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Unless she has received additional distributions in 2021 and 2022, she should NOT be receiving 1099-Rs in 2021 and 2022.

She may need to contact whoever is issuing the 1099-Rs to have them voided.

But first ask the client if she did take additional retirement withdrawals after 2020, which would be completely separate and unrelated to the 2022 withdrawal.

[qbteachmt]

From: https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/coronavirus-related-relief-for-retirement-plans-and-iras-questions-and-...

"Q4. What is a coronavirus-related distribution? 

A4. A coronavirus-related distribution is a distribution that is made from an eligible retirement plan to a qualified individual from January 1, 2020, to December 30, 2020, up to an aggregate limit of $100,000 from all plans and IRAs."

Any distribution after that date range did not qualify as covid-related. There might be other disaster distributions for which this taxpayer qualifies; or, there might be regular distributions that are taxable. Or, this person keeps taking money that now is subject to early distribution penalty. All of these would be taxable to some degree in the year taken, if they were from deferred plan accounts. The issuer of the first distribution is unlikely to have kept issuing forms in the later years, as they would not even know if a covid-related distribution was reported all in that first tax year.

It seems your taxpayer hasn't clearly stated what is their ongoing activity, in this case.