So the Form 7202 says it wont be able to be Efiled?

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

In the release dates:

Form 7202, Credits for Sick Leave and Family Leave for Certain Self-Employed Individuals (Taxpayer)

Final on 01/28/2021, EF Not Allowed

Prepare for the complaints now.

And still no 8915E showing as going to be included....wooohooo be prepared for an angry mob with torches and pitchforks if that form doesnt get included!   

[BobKamman]

Do you think the 7202 ban is from Intuit, or from IRS?  It may be that IRS wants to take a close look at each one before allowing it, because of the fraud connected to other high-dollar credits in the past.  

[IRonMaN]

Or another case of Intuit "interpreting" what the IRS says vs how the the rest of the tax world interprets it..

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

I'm asking in another group for people that use software other than ProSeries if they have the same limitation.

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

Does NOT appear to be an IRS limitation, other software has no indication that the form cannot be Efiled.

[garman22]

is it possible that Intuit has not been approved for 7202 yet from IRS? Im guessing thats the case, Intuit seems to be behind on many things these last few years. 

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

Now Im seeing from someone else that the IRS Schema isnt updated for this form since it uses a 2019 lookback (the people that said it was allowed to be efiled in their software, may not realize it cant be done yet?)...but the EIC form does a 2019 lookback too...soooo I dunno what the truth is.

[Ernie]

@Orlando  are these going to be included or attached as a PDF?

[IRonMaN]

Nice to see you Ernie.  Although it is a little hard to see you through all of that dust. 😀

[Ernie]

Thanks @IRonMaN .  I thought of you when my lukefish didn't show up for Christmas.

How have you been? 

[IRonMaN]

I've been doing well.  How about yourself? 

If I knew you were going to be stopping in today I would have picked up some chocolate ice cream on my way to the office this morning.

[Ernie]

I have been doing well also.  I have come to like chocolate ice cream - starting to stay away from vanilla though - who knew???

[IRonMaN]

2020 was a weird year.  Your conversion to chocolate ice cream kinda proves that 😉

[athaureaux6]

I do not think you can attach it as a PDF. I believe you will have to eliminate the form (supporting worksheet) in order to attach it and that will erase the amount on Line 12 b scd. 3 . You can not input the amount of the sick leave credit directly on Line 12 b. it is transfer from the worksheet. And if you overwrite it, it will give you an error for e-filing. 

I personally believe that they have to fix this because it is going to cause a lot head aches if we can not efile a whole return because of this. 

[SDJayhawk · Accepted solution]

Hello!  I'm an Intuit employee who works in development on the business products.

We have confirmed with the IRS that Form 7202 is not efileable.

[Ernie]

@SDJayhawk, When we have a return with 7202 will we have to paper file the return or will we e-file the return with that form as an attachment?

Dusty Ernie

[SDJayhawk]

We aren't able to confirm if Form 7202 can be filed as a generic PDF attachment at this time but we are exploring it.

[Bsch4477]

I received this reply from Taxslayer. 

To the best of our knowledge it (Form 7202) is allowed to be e-filed.  We have found no information to the contrary at this time.  As the form is new, we are still waiting on the final specs from the IRS, so that could change, but as of now we believe so. 

@SDJayhawk Can you give us a citation from the IRS which makes a determination regarding this?

[TaxGuyBill]

---

@Bsch4477 wrote:

I received this reply from Taxslayer. 

To the best of our knowledge it (Form 7202) is allowed to be e-filed.  We have found no information to the contrary at this time.  As the form is new, we are still waiting on the final specs from the IRS, so that could change, but as of now we believe so. 

@SDJayhawk Can you give us a citation from the IRS which makes a determination regarding this?

---

Generally, there would not be a citation to say something like this can not happen.  The citation would be the 2020 MEF programming specs, which likely does not show Form 7202.  The software companies may verbally communicate with the IRS and be told something (such as "no, we are not programming that to e-file, that is why it is not in the MEF specs").  So it may be true that they don't have information that it CAN'T be e-filed, they likely don't have information that it CAN be e-filed.

I understand why the IRS and software companies would not want to program this form for MEF; is only valid for a year or two.  It is annoying, but I understand it.

But as previously mentioned, this needs to be able to be attached as a PDF.  And ProSeries needs to program it so we can fill out the 7202 in the software and have the numbers flow to where they need to be, and still allow us to e-file the tax return (with the 7202 as a PDF attachment).

[athaureaux6]

I really hope that PS will fix that problem and at least allow us to attach it as a PDF. It is going to be very problematic if they do not fix it. But if Drake did, they will have too, it is the same company. 

[TaxGuyBill]

No, Drake is NOT the same company.  Drake is a GOOD company that care about its software and its customers.  Intuit (the owners of ProSeries) doesn't care about its software's accuracy or customers.

[TaxGuyBill]

I posted this on another thread, but I'll post it here too ....

I got a response from Drake ...  

Although Form 7202 or 8915E can not be directly e-filed, it CAN be attached as a PDF (and Drake automatically flows the numbers and prompts you to attach the PDF).

What ProSeries will do, I have no idea.

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

What about the 8615E...PDF attachment?

[TaxGuyBill]

I forgot to mention that ... Drake says the same thing.  PDF attachment.  I'll edit my post above to add that.

[IRonMaN]

Just don't post again ------------------ that smiley face appears to be growing with each post.  Pretty soon it is going to be the size of the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man.

[TaxGuyBill]

 LOL.  Yeah, I have no idea why that got so big.  I copy-and-pasted my answer from the other post, so maybe that made it act weird.

🍹

[TaxGuyBill]

Just testing the Stay Puft pictures ...

[TaxGuyBill]

Yep, the copy and paste makes it big.

[TaxGuyBill]

[athaureaux6]

I do not know how it will be sent as a PDF. If we remove it from the return to attach it as a PDF the software will delete the amount that flowed to the 7202 line. I already tried it, if you leave, it will not allow it to efile it. I believe they should fix this because for this year, that form will be used a lot I think. But I can see the IRS is expecting a lot of fraud with this because it has happened before. But I hope they fix this problem. 

[TaxGuyBill]

---

@athaureaux6 wrote:

if you leave, it will not allow it to efile it. 

---

You are right, Intuit NEEDS to allow a return to be e-filed with the PDF.  That is not optional.

@Just-Lisa-Now- , can you post this in the Lounge and let the Moderators know that this is NOT an optional thing, it is something that the developers NEED to do.

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

@SDJayhawk was checking into this, but I'll throw it up in the Lounge as well.

[TaxGuyBill]

Thank you!

As a side note, I never trust the "checking into this" from Intuit.  They say that way to often and then it seems like they hope you forget about it.

[IRonMaN]

"I never trust the "checking into this" from Intuit"

That goes to the Checking Into This Team.  But it doesn't help matters to try and get Intuit to listen to us if Lisa is spending her time throwing up in the lounge 🤒

[SDJayhawk]

All - 

Form 7202 is not set up for efile in the IRS system so will not be supported. 

We have inquired and not received clear guidance from the IRS to date, but the IRS will allow the PDF attach of any form. 

Hope this helps,

Stephanie

[IRonMaN]

@SDJayhawk  - But part two of the question was about fixing the issue of actually completing form 7202.  From what I understand, if you complete the form in the software, you will get a message that prevents e-filing of the the return because form 7202 is "attached" to the return.  Will something be done to allow folks to actually complete the return using the form and then attach the 7202 as a pdf?

[SDJayhawk]

All - 

The form is not part of the IRS efiling system.  A return with a Form 7202 will not be blocked from efiling as long as the Form 7202 is attached as a PDF to the return.  

Thanks,

Stephanie

[IRonMaN]

@SDJayhawk  Maybe you answered and the anvils are taking its toll, but in order to get to the point of being able to create a pdf, folks will be entering data into the form 7202 included in their program.  Will they be able to transmit the return with the completed form in the software or are they going to have to delete the form and then override the software to get the numbers to flow through the return?

[athaureaux6]

Hi, I wonder if you know how to attach it as a PDF without deleting it. If we fill it up, the credit will flow to line 12 b, but as soon as you erase it, the software will erase the amount of the credit in line 12 b. The only solution will be to allow, in Line 12 b, to input the amount of the credit manually, I do not see any other option. I talked to somebody who  uses Drake, they can do that way. I hope you guys will fix it. 

[SDJayhawk]

All - 

I apologize for the confusion....

Prepare the return which includes Form 7202 with the credit amount flowing as designed.  Print a PDF copy of Form 7202 and attach it as a generic or "other" PDF attach to the electronic filing.  Since the Form 7202 is not part of the electronically filed return, it does not need to be removed.   The form is included in the electronic filing as a PDF attachment.

Please let us know if the above doesn't solve the issue.

Thanks,

Stephanie

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

Will we have to turn off error checking in order to convert for Efiling? or will it just be ignored and not cause an error?

[SDJayhawk]

It should not cause an error.  Are you guys seeing error messages related to this situation?  

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

Not enough forms are final to be able to convert anything for Efiling yet...so we dont know yet.

[athaureaux6]

of course there is an error. you need to delete the form because you said it. it can 't be efiled. when you delete it, the credit disappears. Nobody knows how to attach it as a pdf without deleting it.  

[Just-Lisa-Now-]

Id be very surprised if we could leave it in there as is without an Efile error.

I know you mean well @SDJayhawk Stephanie, but this isnt how the forms generally work. 

If a form that cant be Efiled, is included in a return, then the only way to efile that return is to delete that unEfileable form....or maybe turn off the error checking at the time of conversion.

[SDJayhawk]

Fair enough!  I'll do some more digging....thanks for the information.

[SDJayhawk]

I've passed along the concerns to the appropriate development team.  Form 7202 is not final and is still in the development process.  When released final, you will not have to mail a return that contains a Form 7202.